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Home Sweet Home - Respawn at base


semipr0

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You know this might seem a bit off in DayZ but.....I've always found it a little odd that in mods like Epoch and Origins, you spend all this time building stuff to keep your things in and stay safe in....but the minute you die...you have to survive a run all the way back to your stuff just to get back to it.

 

This might seem a little care bear, but is it entirely impossible in the Arma system to reset a player spawn point by using a constructible object like a sleeping bag which could be placed in a base to basically have a player respawn at their base on death?

 

I realize this seems a little against the grain of how DayZ works, but I've gotten quite a few complaints from players that play on my server that they get killed by someone camping their base and then they can't even get back to their base due to the long run and/or the base being blockaded by the people that killed them.

 

Is it possible to get constructible beds/sleeping bags that could then prompt the character on creation to ask whether they want to spawn randomly or at home? And perhaps a way to make the "at home" spawn cause them to spawn say at 6000 blood (to immersively emulate the need for recuperation from a near death experience perhaps).

 

Anyways is this something that is feasible? Is it something that even makes sense in Epoch? I think I'd like it...if I knew specifically how to do it myself but I'm only just coming to grips with Arma modding myself...but it seems like this could be done with some additions to player_death.sqf.

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The best solution I thought worked best is to play with a group of people or friends you actually trust to help you out with situations like that. I know the fact of building something to keep your things in are always going to be invaded by other players one way or another, the only thing I would request is to just use safes to store your things in, maybe map out where you put your safes in different location so that when you do spawn you can always gather somethings close by. I don't see the point in puting a spawn point at your base if like you said players camp on each others bases. You would just die and die again over and over. Maybe put a rule on the server saying no griefing or camping. I help run a server and that seems to help. No matter what for Epoch there will be always jerks and the only thing you can really do is try to out smart them.

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Death should remain as much of a punishment as possible. 

 

Right I get that, but death is also inevitable in DayZ. No matter how good you are, theres always going to be someone that sees you before you see them.

 

The question I am posing here is not "how to make death suck less" but "how do we make all this time and effort more functionally worth peoples time."

 

See, simple facts are, you can basically just buy a safe in Epoch and you're essentially done. Why? Because sinking a ton of time and effort and resources into building a pretty little mimicry of a house around that safe is entirely pointless...other than to perhaps allow you not to get shot in the back while accessing said safe.

 

So what I'm basically saying is, how do we make base building actually beneficial? Since people can destroy it....theres almost no benefit to putting the time into it other than to play "fort" or "king of the hill" for as long as you can survive.

 

The only thing I can really think of that would make base building wholly worthwhile is the ability to respawn after death at your base, and potentially to allow for sleep healing/offline healing at it.

 

Cause that way you at least feel like you've staked some sort of claim to Chernarus and not like you're constantly having to revisit it every time you die.

 

Its not that I don't think death should be harsh, its just that death is almost preferable to building a complex base in Epoch that serves little to no purpose once you've died. (especially with the plot pole loss on death, cause then you may not even be able to get to your safe after some chucklehead covers it with tents).

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I would only agree with this if you didn't die to a player or zombie. If you fell and died within 100m of your home then that would prevent abuse.

 

HOWEVER, it seems like a ton of programming and testing for something that isn't an issue if you are careful. I have never died building my base, but I usually hold the sneak key down when walking around in the upper levels placing stuff.

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I would only agree with this if you didn't die to a player or zombie. If you fell and died within 100m of your home then that would prevent abuse.

 

HOWEVER, it seems like a ton of programming and testing for something that isn't an issue if you are careful. I have never died building my base, but I usually hold the sneak key down when walking around in the upper levels placing stuff.

 

Oh I think that if you die to a player or a zombie its still just as viable.

 

Why? Because you still might need to go try to retrieve your gear. Chances are if you die to a player or a zombie...you're likely out in the field somewhere. And even if you get to respawn "at home" where you might have some gear on hand to help you negotiate the recovery of your corpse...theres still the fact that certain items like your vehicle keys that you might have been carrying are going to be lost, plus any and all valuables on the corpse.

 

In the case of a death by a player you're likely going to get looted and you'll lose your vehicles and any truly valuable things you were carrying, this is exactly the same as it is if you respawn at the coast....its simply different in of which you're actually rewarded for putting effort into the base building system by taking a small amount of sting out of the death by at least reducing your recovery time by a certain amount (though depending on where you die it may be just as much as a coast run)...you still lose everything you'd lose if you get respawned at the coast in a PVP death...so I don't see that as an issue at all. Death to a zombie is more or less the same thing, if you don't go back for your gear, it will be lost on next restart or if someone finds your corpse and loots it...again no different than a coast run would be, the only real difference is that your base has awarded you the ability to spawn somewhere relatively safe where you can throw together some back up gear and perhaps even use a secondary vehicle to roll out on your recovery run.

 

Now if you die to a player AT your base, you're then in the conundrum of having to continually deal with the problem that killed you. If you're unable to deal with it, or you simply log out to try to avoid it, you stand a good chance of having your base pulled down...in which situation you may no longer have a modified respawn point the next time you log in, so this would also incentivize defending your base to the best of your ability cause if you don't defend it, you're likely to lose it entirely and all the benefits that come with it. All that's lost right now, to be honest, if someone takes down your base, is the time and effort you put into making it and to be honest....thats not a benefit you're losing. The only incentive to defend your base right now in Epoch is because its yours and someones attacking it. But if you're simply outmatched...you can just log out, say screw it and come back at a later time when the person has gotten bored with destroying your stuff....cause the one thing that they can't destroy is the safe...so theres no real reason to care about the base at all because its not providing any tangible game system improvements that generate a high impulse to attain them or retain them.

 

So overall dying to a player or a zombie in an altered spawn point scenario is kind of immaterial because the penalties are ostensibly the same, but the minor reduction in hassle a home base spawn point gives is a nice enough benefit to perhaps make the house worth making in the first place and, of course, defending til you're out of bullets as well.

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Its a neat concept, everyone's considered it a time or two and all ultimately came to the same conclusion.  It's just too far.
Although it would be nice a time or two and have it's own cool feel to it, I honestly believe it would cause immense damage to the value we establish in our characters.
 

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Its a neat concept, everyone's considered it a time or two and all ultimately came to the same conclusion.  It's just too far.

Although it would be nice a time or two and have it's own cool feel to it, I honestly believe it would cause immense damage to the value we establish in our characters.

 

 

Well the value we establish in our characters is immediately lost once we die. So the only option is...not to die, but death is an inevitability in DayZ...its going to happen.

 

The issue is not that death changes devalue the character but the lack of death changes devalues the base building concept in and of itself. The base itself is not providing any real benefits other than adding a relatively visible target to the landscape.

 

So why base at all? This is what I'm trying to pose as a question. Other than the obvious fact that you "can" build a base, what purpose is it ultimately serving in regards to the value of your character? As things currently stand in my assessment of the additional game dynamics that Epoch brings to the table...the base building aspect serves no purpose because it confers absolutely no advantages for having done it.

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That's the problem many small groups are realizing. Right now, there's really no reason to build a base at all. You have to spend time gathering materials, then time building, effort maintaining.

 

Meanwhile, someone can some along and if they're patient enough, destroy it with a hatchet or sledgehammer. There are many ways to break into bases(some legit, and some less), so having tents or storage of any kind is not safe.

 

The only thing that is safe is having safes. Basically, why bother investing effort into anything other than acquiring more safes? Now we're talking about moving safes closer to the beaches since thats where we will spawn and need access to gear anyway. Think about what the pattern is- you start building a base somewhere inland then radiate outwards from it getting more gear. You always return to home base to stash goods. If you die, you end up getting only enough goods to make it to home base where you re-equip and start the process over. When you die in any fashion away from base, even if you spawn at base you're probably going to want to get your gear. This means you have to do the usual process of a run to the corpse and back. It also would eliminate people killing themselves for 'bad spawns' as they will always spawn where they want to be anyway.

 

During a PVP type encounter, you would want to defend your base. The enemy might also know you will spawn there, so it will both keep combat going and provide a method of 'trolling' via camping(sieges!). Game mechanics would need to be worked out(semi random spawning within 100m maybe to prevent spawn camping) but it would encourage defending your base. The enemy could also stop you from spawning there by destroying some structure(plot pole?).

 

I started this thread completely against spawning in bases but the more I thought about it, the more it made sense. It opens up a lot of possible gameplay elements that start to make base placement both more important and more practical. People are starting to realize once you get past the gold accumulation and storage phases, there's not a lot more depth to the gameplay over other mods. I think this could be a big changer in how game mechanics play out and groups handle interaction.

 

I really hope this idea is at least given some more serious consideration. 

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  • 1 month later...

I agree with what Gimmic said with a slight tune-up. How about making the "base-spawn" take one or two minutes or maybe longer? If there would be a siege and folks coming to raid you, you wouldn't be able just to bounce up and start defending after dying. That it would give the raiders a chance to steal the stuff. Not that our laa-laa happyplace-server condones raiding at this point, but for those who do ;)

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Im totally against this idea.

 

Sure I would love it to respawn in my base BUT:

 

1st: It would make bases way too powerfull and change the whole game feeling. Everyone would camp in their bases, since when you die you respawn there. Mostly even before your gear can be looted.

 

- why will a time delay not work? Either it's just too short. (2 or 3 min) ... in this time a well built base cannot be invaded. Or it's so long (30-60 min) that not many would love to wait that time .. Faster to walk.

 

- why will a 'not if killed through player or zombie' not work? Because it's just 1 respawn more. At the coast everyone will suicide in a way which let you respawn in your base.

 

2nd: It will make death to a joke. You can just "port" back in your base with suicide .. Totally worthless game this way.

 

Whoover like the idea, just: forget it!

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The only thing I can really think of that would make base building wholly worthwhile is the ability to respawn after death at your base, and potentially to allow for sleep healing/offline healing at it.

 

My base gives me:

 

1. Ability to store more than a really expensive Safe. A Storage Shed can hold 40 guns and 400 items and I can put multiples of them in my "base". 

 

2. Safe location to access things. It really stinks when you are swapping gear and someone takes a shot at you. 

3. Safe location to log out and in.

4. Safe location to put a vehicle. Even locked vehicles can be destroyed. <- I think this is the primary reason for most people

5. Safe spot to boil my water, cook my meat, get warm.

6. Vantage point

Now I could build a base in Cherno and have one heck of a wild time trying to keep it in one piece and that could be a lot of fun. I was looking for a much more relaxed base though. ;)

 

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Server admins can change the spawn points so they aren't always on the coast. I always have mine like this, though spawning in the wilderness is not uncommon :)

In two minds about this. There are merits on both sides. If you always spawned at your base you would lose out on a lot of what makes dayz, yet industrial accidents are common.

Tricky and needs investigating..

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The sole purpose behind the punishment and harshness of death, is to encourage survivors to avoid death and instead preserve their life. Allowing someone who died the option to spawn at their home or base, is encouraging people not to preserve life but instead be careless with it. You take out a core part of the game, which is to second guess or think twice about the situations you face. Making good or bad choices is a huge part of the game, and mistakes happen and sometimes your rewarded - it's all a game of chance. However knowing you can spawn back at your home/base after death, and be re-geared changes the entire attitude and mindset of players. "I died, but no worries I'll just spawn at the base, re-gear, and be back in the action in a jiffy."

 

Additions to the mod should be towards reasons to preserve one's life, not to derail it further. Death carries it's own benefits, such as rewarding the player with a fresh new experience. You'll most likely run into different survivors and obstacles along the journey - even if it's just back to your home/base. The thing I see with this idea, and even other add-on scripts people already install - they reduce the time or effect needed to get things done - aka making everything easier.

 

With that said, against the idea.

 

//tip - always good to keep your eggs in different baskets.

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  Ok so all this work to make an obviously exploitable mechanic.

 

  Die in a way that wont let me spawn at my base (player kill for instance) then just jump off a building on the coast so I can then spawn at my base. 

 

  Personally I think we need to stop trying to find ways to make DayZ easier.  Its a survival game, we die and sometimes we lose things (like keys) forever. 

 

  Don't like spawning at the coast?  Play a different game.

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  Don't like spawning at the coast?  Play a different game.

 

I really disagree with this statement. We're playing a mod of a mod. By that logic, if you don't like Vanilla DayZ maybe you should play a different game?

 

We make this game into what we want, as a community. 

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I kinda like the idea as long as it comes with strict limitations.  Too much and I'm pretty certain it will kill the DayZ feeling.

 

Tie it to an object like a plot pole.  Delete the old one on spawn in - one shot and done, until you place another.  Give a choice to use it or not at character creation.  Make it persist through a couple 'No' choices or make it 'use it or lose it' depending on the level of spawn picking you want to tolerate.

 

You could make a new object (sleeping bag) but using the plot pole would destroy the placement restrictions if you decided to use the respawn function.  More people would use the plot poles.  You could bump the price or possibly treat it as a backpack for inventory purposes to restrict over usage and hoarding a bit.

 

Really, I think the only way this concept can work is by keeping a very tight leash on it.

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  • 2 weeks later...

What about tying it to an item not really used, umm, like the grave cross thing.. make it a buyable option, only allowing you to have 1(firm) maybe tied to your UID or something, and it has to be placed, and not near anything buildings/buildables, say 500m, and your spawning at it removes the item from the DB, so to do it again, you would need to re-buy it and place it again.

Which would also only give you a 1time re-spawn at a loc of your choice.

 

Then, its kinda like a spawn point, but not inside your base, nor cities/towns, so you could be coming out from the wilderness..

 

Personally, I have no frigging idea if this would be at all possible, was just having a thought process about the thread is all

 

Bags

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this would completely negate the perma-death element of Dayz that makes it so intense. having a safe full of gear already does that but at least the penalty for dying is a 20 minute run back to base

 

people would just stick to their tiny area of the map so if they are killed they can respawn near their body and either get all their gear back or find their killer. 

 

at the very most id like to see an option to spawn in the north or the south, and thats it, no choices of cities or anything you can just pick the half of the map and then you get a random spawn in that half

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