Thoughts on a complex Ballistic system like this ?

[gibonez]

How would you guys feel about Epoch having a complex ballistic system like the one below ?

 

I personally think it would fix the balancing with sniping, as it would no longer be point and click and actually require skill, experience and good problem solving skills.

 

 

 

--- Description ---
This addon introduces advanced external and internal ballistics to the game. It is entirely client-side and only affects small arms fire from human players.

It makes long range shooting much more challenging and enjoyable.



--- Features ---
- Drag resistance based on ambient air density (air pressure, temperature, humidity)
- Wind drift (Wind speed varies with the height above ground and obstacles like buildings or certain terrain features can mitigate the wind)
- Spin drift
- Coriolis effect
- Eötvös effect
- Decreasing bullet stability through the transonic region (-> significant dispersion beyond supersonic flight)
- Ammo temperature affects muzzle velocity
- High power scopes get adjustable Mil/MOA Turrets
- Wind info
- Protractor

-- Coming features ---
- Appropriate ballistic tables

--- How to use ---
- You can enable/disable all features in the userconfig/hpp file.
- Default key combination for showing the wind indicator is SHIFT+K
- Default key combination for showing the protractor is CTRL+SHIFT+K
- Default keys for turning the scope turret dials are (UP, DOWN, LEFT, RIGHT)

--- Compatibility ---
- Fully compatible with 3rd party ammunition and weapons
- Fully compatible with weather modification addons
- Compatible with addons like AGM, that add wind deflection, if you disable wind drift in the userconfig file (advancedballistics_config.hpp)

--- Guideline for 3rd party weapon/ammunition developers ---
If you wish to support this addon, then please add the following configuration data to your weapon and ammo classes:

Ammo class:
AB_caliber - bullet caliber in inches
AB_bulletLength - bullet length in inches
AB_bulletMass - bullet mass in grains
AB_ammoTempMuzzleVelocityData[] - array of muzzle velocity shifts with 11 data points from 0°F to 100°F (example: {-91, -86, -78, -68, -57, -42, -23, 0, 29, 65, 110})

Weapon class:
AB_barrelTwist - barrel twist rate in inches
AB_twistDirection - direction of twist (-1 = left, 0 = no rifling, 1 = right)

--- Changelog ---
release 12:
-Add a bullet trace effect (only visible when looking through high power optics)

release 11:
-Fixed bullet trajectory not being altered at all when AB_REDUCED_PRECISION was set to false
-Added a humidity simulation, based on real world climate graphs
-Small performance improvement when multiple trajectories are calculated at the same time

release 10:
-Fixed incorrect calculation of muzzle velocity variation due to ammo temperature
-Fixed coriolis drift not working since version 0.9
-Fixed spin drift not working since version 0.9
-Added a userconfig entry that allows you to disable the advanced ballistics for bullets coming from other players
-Added a userconfig entry that allows you to reduce the calculation precision in order to avoid frame drops
-Minor performance optimizations

release 09:
-Added bullet caliber, bullet length, bullet mass, barrel twist direction and barrel twist rate config data to all vanilla small arms weapons and ammunition
-3rd party ammunition developers can now specify a transonic stability coefficient in the ammo config that defines how well the bullet performs during transonic flight (0 unstable - 1 stable)
-3rd party ammunition developers can now specify a ammo temperature muzzle velocity variatian array in the ammo config that defines how the muzzle velocity varies with ammo temperature
-The stability factor and thereby spin drift now depends on the ammo and weapon config as well as atmospheric conditions
-The wind indicator and protractor will now be visible as long as you hold down the respective key combination, or 10 seconds if you release them earlier
-Fixed a bug in temperature calculation that occurred on some 3rd party maps
Multiplayer related:
-The addon is now qualified for use on a server
-Added a userconfig setting that allows the server to override the client settings
-Temperature simulation is now properly synchronized across all clients if the server also runs the addon

release 08:
- Minor code change - required to fix an issue the ATragMX and Kestrel 4500 addons had, after using team switch in singleplayer

release 07:
- (Shift+K) wind reading is now also affected by the effect obstacles and terrain have on the wind
- Wind speed near the ground (< 20m) is now considerably slower in urban areas
- Temperature now varies with altitude
- Temperature and barometric pressure are now affected by weather changes
- Added a new config entry to the userconfig file, where you can disable the advanced ballistics during full auto fire
- Fixed advanced ballistics not being active after using team switch

release 06:
-New wind features: The wind speed now varies with the height above ground and obstacles like buildings or certain terrain features can mitigate the wind
-Added a protractor that visualizes the inclination angle of your rifle (default key combination: CTRL+SHIFT+K)

release 05:
-Several bugfixes

release 04:
-Improved performance
-(experimental) Everbody should now see the same bullet flight path in multiplayer

release 03:
-Mil turret system works with every high power scope (opticType=2)
-Improved visualizing of the current scope turret setting
-Every scope now has its own setting memory
-Shift+K wind estimation (similar to Arma 2 ACE)

release 02:
-Fixed latitude not corresponding with map

release 01:
-Initial release

--- Download ---
Zip Package: @AdvancedBallistics_v1.2.zip

--- Requirements ---
* CBA - Community Base Addons
* (optional): Kestrel4500
* (optional): ATragMX

 

 

 

Highly recommend this mod it once again shows the talent and dedication that the Arma 3 community has.

[TNT]

that mod is bad ass!

[DeceitfulPhoenix]

If you've watched any of the streams or paid much attention the rules of the Make ArmA Not War contest you would know that with entries such as Epoch, creations by other people are generally not allowed. Everything currently in the A3 Epoch is done inhouse. Such a system would be interesting but seems a little too complex for something like Epoch. With mods such as the one you've demonstrated they have a much stronger presence in MSO type missions rather than almost complete overhaul mods such as Epoch.

[gibonez]

If you've watched any of the streams or paid much attention the rules of the Make ArmA Not War contest you would know that with entries such as Epoch, creations by other people are generally not allowed. Everything currently in the A3 Epoch is done inhouse. Such a system would be interesting but seems a little too complex for something like Epoch. With mods such as the one you've demonstrated they have a much stronger presence in MSO type missions rather than almost complete overhaul mods such as Epoch.

 

Hence why I was simply refering to the mod as an example.

 

Of course they would have to do their own inhouse ballistic simulation. I only wanted to see what peoples opinions would be to such a good system being implemented and the advantages it would bring to gameplay.

[DeceitfulPhoenix]

Hence why I was simply refering to the mod as an example.

 

Of course they would have to do their own inhouse ballistic simulation. I only wanted to see what peoples opinions would be to such a good system being implemented and the advantages it would bring to gameplay.

"With mods such as the one you've demonstrated they have a much stronger presence in MSO type missions rather than almost complete overhaul mods such as Epoch.". Not only would the addition of a system such as the one demonstrated be overly complex for something like Epoch and scare more people off than it would draw in but the system itself isn't even one that would really benefit an overhaul mod like Epoch in anyway. To shoot for realism such as the ones demonstrated in mods such as ACE and the like would prove to be overly annoying for those playing the game as it's not skill that these mods involve but rather the prediction of movement, and the readings given by several tools.

 

Move such a scenario into something like Epoch and unless you've got every gadget needed which one would assume that the player would have to find and considering they're military equipment wouldn't be the most common of items, shooting anything further than 400m is going to involve a hell of a lot of luck more than anything else.

 

Such a system is overly complicated and really has no place in anything other than MSO missions due to it's complexity. Don't get me wrong, I love such system and use them almost constantly but it doesn't make the game harder for long range engagement's all it does is add twelve different things you have to gauge before taking the shot and in something like Epoch, that (And I'm basing this off the DayZmod version of Epoch) firefights are generally fairly fast paced compared to MSO's and having to gauge all this would be more of a pain in the ass and that's assuming that someone took the time to find absolutely every gadget required to judge, wind direction, speed. distance to target and velocity of the bullet.

 

Even to say that a system would have a place in Epoch would be something but then look at the amount of effort required on the developer's parts. These mods are completed overhaul's of the ballistics systems and for a relatively small dev team such as Epoch's would take a substantial amount of time to complete and that's only if they spend no time developing Epoch either. 

[gibonez]

The gadget would not be needed for most shooters its just a tool better help predict dope for a rifle.

 

The system would also absolutely not scare anyone off, as they don't have to even be aware of it. To new players it would just seem like there is wind in the game and then they would lead their shots to compensate for the wind, as they get more experienced they will learn to read the wind and eventually they will go out of their way to educate themselves on the intriquacises of long range shooting in order to make those 1000m shots.

 

 

This system would only do one thing and that is reward the people who put time and effort into something.

[Dobrowney]

You know what the cool thing is. Once Epoch releases the server files public you will be able to add these mods you talk about to your server and fully customize it to how you want. There is no reason for the Epoch devs to work on addons that have been done and are working well. If they keep the mod simple it allows for server owners to build and customize their epoch world as they see fit. This is how dayz Epoch is and is why you have mods out like Overpoch. Awol and the dev team make their mod easy for server owners to edit and adjust, and they support you doing it.

[Sequisha]

Phoenix pretty much hit the nail on the head.  He's absolutely right particularly in terms of pace and acquisition of the items necessary to facilitate accuracy. 
Most firefights and encounters happen so quickly that the inaccuracy of your shots would feel like SA's...essentially making the player feel cheated.  I like imperfections of a weapons firing, as long as they're consistent...I also like an environment affecting the bullets trajectory, as long as it's gauged, visible and makes sense.  Which the latter would clutter up the screen: one of the things we're really trying to free up.

[Dr Weshnaw]

This would be pretty cool, but at the same time I don't think it would work as well in this situation...