Idea for "Karma" System

[CRY3rn]

Almost everyone has a problem with "KoS" (Kill on Sight) players. A lot of people have suggested adding punishments for killing from bounty systems to the (totally not flaming) loss of krypto. What if, just what if, there was an insanity system implemented, such that not being around anyone (lone wolf?) or killing people affects your sanity levels. The effects could range from sudden bouts of shaking, random laughter or mental breakdowns. Just an idea that I thought may be interesting.

[GasT]

It´s a PVP mod why should you be punished?

[BetterDeadThanZed]

It´s a PVP mod why should you be punished?

 

Are you really going to take it down this road? There's plenty of discussions of PVP vs PVE, so let this guy's post develop as it should, mkay?

[GasT]

Are you really going to take it down this road? There's plenty of discussions of PVP vs PVE, so let this guy's post develop as it should, mkay?

 

So I should not express what I think? I think its wrong punishing a killer with shakes and laughter that gives them away.

[BetterDeadThanZed]

So I should not express what I think? I think its wrong punishing a killer with shakes and laughter that gives them away.

 

Perhaps a system that mimics the human response to killing other humans should be considered.

[CRY3rn]

Lol, why not. At the end of the day, it's really up to the devs. I'm just suggesting an alternative to the old Karma system that seems to be more realistic. The devs could always make the "Insanity" system able to be turned off on a server to server basis. Having more options is always better.

 

Also, it doesn't necessarily have to be shakes and laughter but maybe sometime that would demonstrate you being.... insane?

[Mr. G]

It´s a PVP mod why should you be punished?

 

Yeah it's PvP it's not "go kill whatever moves".

There can be good PvP, done as it would be done in real life, like to gain or defend a resource, food, vehicles, equipment...

The bad PvP is the KOS thing where you kill just to kill. No real reason for it.

 

If I get killed in action I never whine.

What is annoying is when I'm just walking around and I get killed by another survivor for no reason.

Not even stealing my stuff.

 

This game should simulate a survival situation and if it was realistic you wouldn't go around killing anyone you meet.

First of all being alone makes you weaker, whilst being in a group gives a lot of advantages.

Second, in real life, everyone would have different skills that make them valuable.

Do you think that in a survival situation you would kill someone if there was the chance he/she could be a medic?

Or a mechaninc who could fix your broken down car or chopper?

 

So to give incentive to players to behave in a more realistic way a Karma system could be interesting.

It has to be a well thought and meaningful system though.

Not like Dayz Epoch hero/bandit system that had so many flaws and in the end being a hero had no reason if not to role play (and being masochistic).

I know because I wanted to be a hero badly but ended up being a bandit just because I needed to defend myself from KOS fools.

[Xyz]

Are you really going to take it down this road? There's plenty of discussions of PVP vs PVE, so let this guy's post develop as it should, mkay?

 

Well, the OP already took this road "Almost everyone has a problem with "KoS" (Kill on Sight) players."

 

Newsflash: "Almost everyone" most likely doesn't have a problem with KoS, a certain group of people probably does. Personally i'm not sure how big this group is but from playing DayZ for years I can safely assume that KoS is the more common playstyle.

[GasT]

Yeah it's PvP it's not "go kill whatever moves".

There can be good PvP, done as it would be done in real life, like to gain or defend a resource, food, vehicles, equipment...

The bad PvP is the KOS thing where you kill just to kill. No real reason for it.

 

If I get killed in action I never whine.

What is annoying is when I'm just walking around and I get killed by another survivor for no reason.

Not even stealing my stuff.

 

This game should simulate a survival situation and if it was realistic you wouldn't go around killing anyone you meet.

First of all being alone makes you weaker, whilst being in a group gives a lot of advantages.

Second, in real life, everyone would have different skills that make them valuable.

Do you think that in a survival situation you would kill someone if there was the chance he/she could be a medic?

Or a mechaninc who could fix your broken down car or chopper?

 

So to give incentive to players to behave in a more realistic way a Karma system could be interesting.

It has to be a well thought and meaningful system though.

Not like Dayz Epoch hero/bandit system that had so many flaws and in the end being a hero had no reason if not to role play (and being masochistic).

I know because I wanted to be a hero badly but ended up being a bandit just because I needed to defend myself from KOS fools.

 

I KOS just to be sure that I protect my friends/group.. We already have the people We need to survive, If you want it to fit into a story then Me and My group has been alive for a long time during this apocalypse and been betrayed and backstabbed enough times not to trust anymore people.

 

I know there are psychological effects on killers trying to return to normal society´s but in the hotzone´s where it happen does not your human psyche block all this just to be able to survive.

 

Looking at my own evolvement in games/mods like these i have gone from a Hero/Survivalist playstyle to a more Bandit/Psycho killer that put my group before all. And to be honest I don´t find roleplay that interesting trying to make friends and so on, I have enough friends and find building secure bases and group vs group fights to be what makes me play this. We do let some people live that We don´t see as threats but that very few and We do try to give trust to some but almost alway´s get backstabbed.

 

I´m very interested to see what the Epoch Devs have in mind though they have a system on their way where they have tried to take all play styles into account and not only seen it from a single side like most threads do.

[CRY3rn]

Well, the OP already took this road "Almost everyone has a problem with "KoS" (Kill on Sight) players."

 

Newsflash: "Almost everyone" most likely doesn't have a problem with KoS, a certain group of people probably does. Personally i'm not sure how big this group is but from playing DayZ for years I can safely assume that KoS is the more common playstyle.

 

Just because everyone does it doesn't mean they all "want" to do it. Rather, it could simply indicate that the KoS mentality emerged as a necessity since once a player realizes everyone else is killing on sight, the player would also KoS as a precaution since unlike in real life, there are not really any implications to slaughtering people in-game.

[Cletis5]

I hate when people use words like "Almost everyone" I don't have a problem with it at all, and sorry to burst your bubble, but i'd bet a large portion of your "almost everyone" doesn't have a problem with it either, bar your usual PVE tree hugers that want to build and do nothing else. You can't sit there and use that at the beginning of your sentence. You don't speak for the masses so how would you know?

 

Now on to your post after the initial nonsense.

 

I like your idea, it sounds entertaining, but it shouldn't be put in place to punish a players playing habbits. If they done that to pvper's, there would have to be an alternative punishment for bambi tree hugers. Maybe they "urinate themselves when a bandit points a gun at them and they begin shaking uncontrollably for a short period of time.

 

I like the idea, just not the punishment of players because they want to play different to you! Unless there is an equaliser for your type of player.

 

[BetterDeadThanZed]

Lol, why not. At the end of the day, it's really up to the devs. I'm just suggesting an alternative to the old Karma system that seems to be more realistic. The devs could always make the "Insanity" system able to be turned off on a server to server basis. Having more options is always better.

 

Also, it doesn't necessarily have to be shakes and laughter but maybe sometime that would demonstrate you being.... insane?

 

I really like this idea. It like it better than what I had suggested. Definately an optional thing though. The more that the devs can put in that can be turned on/off with a variable, the better. It means less reliance on 3rd party scripts and easier debugging.

[CRY3rn]

Geez, sorry guys, didn't really mean to offend, guess I just hang out with totally different people than most. :P I guess maybe to counter the insanity meter, you could have a boredom meter. You know, after a long time of boredom, your player loses the will to live and keels over to die.

[Cletis5]

There should always be a balancing factor for different playing styles, not just the usual knee jerk reaction of you're a bandit, thus must be punished, or you are a KOS player, thus must be punished.

[CRY3rn]

There should always be a balancing factor for different playing styles, not just the usual knee jerk reaction of you're a bandit, thus must be punished, or you are a KOS player, thus must be punished.

 

Correct but let's face it, without any cons for killing people, the pros of just shooting someone clearly outweigh the cons. Like at the moment:

Killing on Sight:

Pros:

- Loot

- Minimize risk to yourself and your group

 

Cons:

- ... feeling guilty?

- ... making.... friends?

[GasT]

Correct but let's face it, without any cons for killing people, the pros of just shooting someone clearly outweigh the cons. Like at the moment:

Killing on Sight:

Pros:

- Loot

- Minimize risk to yourself and your group

 

Cons:

- ... feeling guilty?

- ... making.... friends?

 

No worries it´s a discussion on a Forum about a mod.

 

Sure I have felt guilty for killing a few in the games/mods but like in real life that wears of the more you do it, but sure I have never killed someone or been in a state of emergency or in a country where anarchy rules and only read some psychology and seen uncensored videos from country´s where anarchy rules for different reasons .

[CRY3rn]

No worries it´s a discussion on a Forum about a mod.

 

Sure I have felt guilty for killing a few in the games/mods but like in real life that wears of the more you do it, but sure I have never killed someone or been in a state of emergency or in a country where anarchy rules and only read some psychology and seen uncensored videos from country´s where anarchy rules for different reasons .

 

But that's my point, the "guilt" you get from blowing someone's head off in-game is completely... ineffective? Like Cletis5 said earlier about requiring balance, it's rather that there is no counterbalance to killing.

[GasT]

But that's my point, the "guilt" you get from blowing someone's head off in-game is completely... ineffective? Like Cletis5 said earlier about requiring balance, it's rather that there is no counterbalance to killing.

 

What I was trying to say was that such guilt wears of after X amount of kills.. Look at hitmans, pirates and countries where anarchy have ruled after natural disasters and war have been. If functioning societies have not stepped in and helped how far would they have gone, remember Epoch displays a world wide disaster where no societies and order once so ever is left to help the survivors unlike the world We have today.  

[BetterDeadThanZed]

I don't understand why people argue against such ideas. Make it something optional that a server owner could enable and if that's not the type of thing you like, you could find a server that doesn't use this setting or set up your own server. As long as the recommendation isn't to make a fundamental, non-optional change to the mod, why does it matter if it's not what you like? Let the admins decide if it's something they want to enable on their server. If it were something like "Make AI missions standard in Epoch and don't provide a way to disable them.", then I could see people speaking against the idea because they may not want missions on their server.

 

I know the original post didn't say anything about a system like this being optional, but like so many other suggestions so far, this would be the best route. Complete configurability without having to rely on third party scripts.

[GasT]

They are already working on a system and I´m waiting for it to come and then I will most probably drop a couple of lines on what my takes on it is. And as I said they are probably taking much more in consideration then PVE players that want to stop all the KOS or like me PVP focused that don´t like Roleplay.

 

Making to much optional will most likely open up for to many servers with different settings, don´t We all want populated servers? Epoch right now is already in a state of way to many servers but hopefully it will tune down cause its funnier with 10 populated servers then 100 servers with 5 people on. Then again populated servers is what I prefer and maybe not you.

 

Wait until they got their system released and hope they have come to a good balance so we will have servers that fit all categories, only my suggestion.

[joemiken]

A bounty board would be cool, but with no name plates, it'd be almost impossible to identify the suspect.  Would it be possible to add a last known location to the bounty?  Maybe even update it when that person interacts with a trader?

 

For example, I murder someone in Gorka.  Bounty states last seen in Gorka.  Then I go to Stary and trade some stuff in, it gets updated to 'last seen in Stary Sobor'

[BetterDeadThanZed]

Making to much optional will most likely open up for to many servers with different settings

 

If all the servers have the same settings, where's the draw to go to one server over another?

[GasT]

If all the servers have the same settings, where's the draw to go to one server over another?

 

Why should players be moving around to different servers? Mod´s like these should have server´s with stable inhabitants not constant movers.

 

Really like the server I´m on which have had quite the stabile base until the serverfiles where released and many started moving around and starting their own servers, some seem to be coming back now though.

 

Digg Breaking Points concept here where they are out for making a mod and not a platform but I like vanilla Epoch better.

 

Communities fighting over players only ruin mods I think.

[Nic]

A bounty board would be cool, but with no name plates, it'd be almost impossible to identify the suspect.  Would it be possible to add a last known location to the bounty?  Maybe even update it when that person interacts with a trader?

 

For example, I murder someone in Gorka.  Bounty states last seen in Gorka.  Then I go to Stary and trade some stuff in, it gets updated to 'last seen in Stary Sobor'

 

I really like this idea.

[BetterDeadThanZed]

Why should players be moving around to different servers? Mod´s like these should have server´s with stable inhabitants not constant movers.

 

They should have a choice of which configuration and features they like best.